Suspension Upgrade - ARB/OME MT64 Discussion (8 Viewers)

[DJ’s Sled]

DY,
You'll see in another post I made a few minutes ago that I am scheduled with Slee on 8 September to have the ADS suspension installed. As I read up on these, I became pretty impressed with them. After hearing my desires for on-road (no trailer sway) and then off-road without the trailer attached where I am ferrying photographers back and forth from various locations quickly, they recommended the ADS units due to their easy accessibility for adjusting compression and their damping characteristics. . We are heading out Friday for Utah.

BENDOU,
I’m back in the Springs this week doing some typical tourist things with my wife and the Barking Bichon! And ‘off-roading’ the city streets!
I towed the trailer over with 50psi in the new 285/70R18 E Toyo AT3s. The new, finished setup does extremely well. It sits almost perfectly level (when I can actually find and stop at a bonafide level spot). No sway, corners very well. I may tweak the anti-sway setting just to confirm I really have that where I want it.
I may go ahead and lower the ball height down 1 setting to test and compare for the ride home.

I’ve been cruising around your local streets with 32-ish psi (cold, measured on a hand gauge). These tires actually seem excellent down at that pressure combined with the MT64 suspension setup. My ride is even better now than last month when we met up.
Road imperfections are significantly more muted now.
The little bit of extra, slower speed body lean that was induced with removal of the AVS - is now gone with the new stronger E tires (and probably helped by the slight increase in wheel track).

For those following this thread, a couple ‘negative’ realities: the new tires are louder up at highway speeds. They are heavier (combined with my new 18x8 wheels) which affects braking (heavier rotational weight) - I felt that immediately. And of course your MPG will likely suffer too (I never bother to measure that so cannot quantify), especially with stop-go driving.
But for towing and crushing lousy streets and roads, daily driving this is working really well for me. It feels, rides and handles great. This is what I envisioned when I first bought the truck!

BENDOU, that new suspension you’re getting will be fabulous! Those guys at Slee definitely got it going on. Anxiously awaiting your report of how well you like it. Safe travels.

DJ.

 

[lowrange44]

BENDOU,
I’m back in the Springs this week doing some typical tourist things with my wife and the Barking Bichon! And ‘off-roading’ the city streets!
I towed the trailer over with 50psi in the new 285/70R18 E Toyo AT3s. The new, finished setup does extremely well. It sits almost perfectly level (when I can actually find and stop at a bonafide level spot). No sway, corners very well. I may tweak the anti-sway setting just to confirm I really have that where I want it.
I may go ahead and lower the ball height down 1 setting to test and compare for the ride home.

I’ve been cruising around your local streets with 32-ish psi (cold, measured on a hand gauge). These tires actually seem excellent down at that pressure combined with the MT64 suspension setup. My ride is even better now than last month when we met up.
Road imperfections are significantly more muted now.
The little bit of extra, slower speed body lean that was induced with removal of the AVS - is now gone with the new stronger E tires (and probably helped by the slight increase in wheel track).

For those following this thread, a couple ‘negative’ realities: the new tires are louder up at highway speeds. They are heavier (combined with my new 18x8 wheels) which affects braking (heavier rotational weight) - I felt that immediately. And of course your MPG will likely suffer too (I never bother to measure that so cannot quantify), especially with stop-go driving.
But for towing and crushing lousy streets and roads, daily driving this is working really well for me. It feels, rides and handles great. This is what I envisioned when I first bought the truck!

BENDOU, that new suspension you’re getting will be fabulous! Those guys at Slee definitely got it going on. Anxiously awaiting your report of how well you like it. Safe travels.

DJ.

Appreciate all the info. Just out of curiosity, have you tested the ride with the new suspension and the AVS fuse installed?

Obviously the AVS shocks are out of the equations, but I’m wondering how it would perform with drive mode settings and EKDSS enabled. It might give you the best of both worlds with the improved ride of the new suspension and the benefits of EKDSS. Unless EKDSS is still enabled and I misread something. Thanks

 

[DJ’s Sled]

Appreciate all the info. Just out of curiosity, have you tested the ride with the new suspension and the AVS fuse installed?

Obviously the AVS shocks are out of the equations, but I’m wondering how it would perform with drive mode settings and EKDSS enabled. It might give you the best of both worlds with the improved ride of the new suspension and the benefits of EKDSS. Unless EKDSS is still enabled and I misread something. Thanks

Actually I think a bit of misunderstanding.
The AVS system is no longer functional. The AVS enabled OE shocks are removed. The OE springs are removed. Those are replaced by the ARB/OME MT64 suspension kit.
The EKDSS is still fully functional and operating as designed, as far as I know.
In the normal on-street drive mode settings everything works as normal - except there is no longer any suspension changes; it’s only the after market suspension at work.

You do make a good point: I don’t believe they actually pulled the AVS fuse; they only unplugged the AVS cables to the shocks and front struts. The EKDSS itself was disabled during the new suspension installation, and then enabled at the end.
So…I am still enjoying the benefits of the EKDSS sway bars on road, plus the new suspension.

If you’ve ever driven the short section of US 24 ‘Woodland Park curves’ into C.Springs..you know what I’m talking about. Just came down there a couple hours ago. The sway bars, new suspension and new tires had me firmly planted to the road.

 

[BENDOU]

Dropped the GX off at Slee this morning. They are working me in over the course of this week as I have an extended trip coming up starting next week. As mentioned earlier, getting the ADS suspension. Last week, I was towing my off-road camper into the wilds of Utah again. You will remember I was having trouble with sway on pavement whenever the road began to have roughness or undulations. Not doing any real measuring, I began to perceive my trailer wasn't quite level with a VERY slight upward angle at the hitch. I found a different receiver that dropped the trailer hitch about 1/2" more making the trailer level.

I then went and weighed the total rig once I was all loaded up getting weights for all three axles. Driving up I-25 from Colo Springs, I had 42 psi all around for the GX and 60 for the trailer. The road behavior was unsettling at around 63 mph. Didn't like the behavior at all. After getting my weights (I have misplaced my weight sheet but recall the front axle was carrying 3000 lbs), I checked out the "load inflation tables" for KO3 tires for my tire size. Discovered I was way high on tire pressures! According to the tables, I needed to be at 34 psi on front, 35-36 on rear axle, and 50 psi on the trailer (trailer also has KO3 tires). After a few hours and a rain shower that cooled the tires, I adjusted the tire pressures to the new numbers. I drove up I-25 again and things were drastically better! I never expected that.

So, the new hitch and the change in tire pressure made a huge improvement. NO SWAY and vastly improved stability! I was shocked at the difference. Before, along with higher tire pressures, I was using Sport+ which "seemed" to control things better (the tendency to sway). And I now found the TOW/HAWL mode was significantly a better setting. I found my speed hitting 78 mph a couple of times as things were so stable (but I quickly backed off those speeds). But was often running 73 mph which I never dared do before. I was even beginning to think I didn't need to upgrade the suspension. But the behavior in rough stuff (on and off-road) and knowing the improvements DJ has seen, I decided to continue with the new suspension. I had Kings on my 2016 4Runner and I want that behavior back.

I'll get the GX back on Saturday and will be able to update later next week as we head out again. Can't wait!

 

[teghogh]

BENDOU,
I’m back in the Springs this week doing some typical tourist things with my wife and the Barking Bichon! And ‘off-roading’ the city streets!
I towed the trailer over with 50psi in the new 285/70R18 E Toyo AT3s. The new, finished setup does extremely well. It sits almost perfectly level (when I can actually find and stop at a bonafide level spot). No sway, corners very well. I may tweak the anti-sway setting just to confirm I really have that where I want it.
I may go ahead and lower the ball height down 1 setting to test and compare for the ride home.

I’ve been cruising around your local streets with 32-ish psi (cold, measured on a hand gauge). These tires actually seem excellent down at that pressure combined with the MT64 suspension setup. My ride is even better now than last month when we met up.
Road imperfections are significantly more muted now.
The little bit of extra, slower speed body lean that was induced with removal of the AVS - is now gone with the new stronger E tires (and probably helped by the slight increase in wheel track).

For those following this thread, a couple ‘negative’ realities: the new tires are louder up at highway speeds. They are heavier (combined with my new 18x8 wheels) which affects braking (heavier rotational weight) - I felt that immediately. And of course your MPG will likely suffer too (I never bother to measure that so cannot quantify), especially with stop-go driving.
But for towing and crushing lousy streets and roads, daily driving this is working really well for me. It feels, rides and handles great. This is what I envisioned when I first bought the truck!

BENDOU, that new suspension you’re getting will be fabulous! Those guys at Slee definitely got it going on. Anxiously awaiting your report of how well you like it. Safe travels.

DJ.

thanks for the write up. it is interesting that you notice the tires to be louder given that they are identical brand model as the OEMs but slightly larger.

 

[DJ’s Sled]

Yes, ‘identical’ brand…but I might argue not exactly the same model.

Besides the obvious size and weight differences, the E load I’m running now have deeper tread. Then there is the larger contact patch..
Plus, we don’t know exactly what Toyo did in total for the Lexus OE version, other than less tread. Things like internal belts and ply’s materials and sizes, and tread compounds can affect noise.

 

[Crozbd1]

In a word, OUTSTANDING new ride!
I’m working on some good in-depth descriptions for everyone..so keep an eye on this post as I add edits, etc.

EDIT 1:
In one word UNBELIEVABLE!
Please excuse my ‘kid with a new toy’ enthusiasm, but that’s really what this MT64 suspension upgrade is for me!

The truck has been transformed. It’s like I drove across Colorado to Slee Offroad with a so-so riding vehicle, and then traded it in for something more fun, safer and smoother. I’m super happy I ponied up the $$ to do this. I didn’t totally trust or understand I’d get this much improvement, but I was wrong. It’s outstanding.

My 2024 Overtrail now steers with essentially perfect response and precision; there is no longer any lag or body movement waiting for the AVS system to respond. Everything on the road is now a true one-handed operation. I was able to drive as fast as I wanted..within common sense bounds of course, but could easily have gone much faster no matter the road surface. Yes, I gave the new suspension a good test.

It never waivered, the truck never jumped around in severely bad sections of road at speed (as it did previously, regardless of AVS setting), all the dramatics are gone. I was able to dive into high and low speed sweepers with complete aplomb and near abandon, and quickly learned I could go even faster than I had previously. It was a quick learning curve!

I drove over on US 50 and 285, with about 33.5 psi cold on a hand gauge (not the TPMS or Viair gauge) on the same SL Terra Grappler G3 tires I’ve had the past several months, 275/70R18. I returned the same way with the same tires and same psi.

I intentionally began driving through and over all kinds of badly deteriorated road sections. Through many of the high speed sweepers I did everything you’re typically not suppose to do while cornering: I was braking, downshifting and intentionally hitting torn up surfaces - all at the same time. At first I was in disbelief..so I did that over and over again. No nose dive, no sudden shift of vehicle weight, no abrupt change of course. Just total composure and float and holding the line. Much safer.

I did have some time on city streets too, running errands at Stevinson Lexus and a local Costco. I had to dial back my speeds there too; the GX now seems to want to go faster and faster. It’s far more plush now on crappy local streets.
And it seems the vibration issue is virtually gone. I no longer felt it yesterday. I will confirm over the next few days.

Slee did a great job. Their installer has now done several of these kits; he is basically their LC250 and GX550 guy. They did the realignment, checked the headlight adjustment. We also talked about a few other things, and took a quick test drive including on some rutted dirt in MTS Dirt mode. Everything was normal, but the ride is more pleasant now.

I was fearful that I might miss ‘having’ the AVS; that I might miss fiddling with the mode selector every time I wanted to go faster, or get a softer ride in town, or make a change for a really broken stretch of road. That fear went out the window really fast.

It’s as if the MT64 has its own internal brain. Softer and plush on city streets, instant response driving over junk, and excellent, confident composure at higher speeds. It’s great not having to think about the suspension anymore!

Absolutely amazing! Again, I’m super happy with this upgrade!

EDIT 2:
Some of you may have wanted some before and after measurements, which I failed to do.
I can do some post-install measurements later though. But Slee aimed to accommodate my towing needs also. So we ended up with a little bit of designed-in rake to handle occasional bigger rear loads. I hope to get the trailer hooked up in a couple weeks and try it out.
However I can definitely see and feel the lift. It’s a very welcome change.

IMO this is how the Overtrail trims should come. Or at least this should be offered as either a PIO or DIO. It just makes the truck that much nicer.
I’m also contemplating larger tires and new wheels in the future. However, my GX now handles and rides so well..that I’m a bit afraid to change anything!

Super helpful. I am going to look into all options when the time comes and this really explains and puts to rest my questions and concerns.

 

[DJ’s Sled]

Dropped the GX off at Slee this morning. They are working me in over the course of this week as I have an extended trip coming up starting next week. As mentioned earlier, getting the ADS suspension. Last week, I was towing my off-road camper into the wilds of Utah again. You will remember I was having trouble with sway on pavement whenever the road began to have roughness or undulations. Not doing any real measuring, I began to perceive my trailer wasn't quite level with a VERY slight upward angle at the hitch. I found a different receiver that dropped the trailer hitch about 1/2" more making the trailer level.

I then went and weighed the total rig once I was all loaded up getting weights for all three axles. Driving up I-25 from Colo Springs, I had 42 psi all around for the GX and 60 for the trailer. The road behavior was unsettling at around 63 mph. Didn't like the behavior at all. After getting my weights (I have misplaced my weight sheet but recall the front axle was carrying 3000 lbs), I checked out the "load inflation tables" for KO3 tires for my tire size. Discovered I was way high on tire pressures! According to the tables, I needed to be at 34 psi on front, 35-36 on rear axle, and 50 psi on the trailer (trailer also has KO3 tires). After a few hours and a rain shower that cooled the tires, I adjusted the tire pressures to the new numbers. I drove up I-25 again and things were drastically better! I never expected that.

So, the new hitch and the change in tire pressure made a huge improvement. NO SWAY and vastly improved stability! I was shocked at the difference. Before, along with higher tire pressures, I was using Sport+ which "seemed" to control things better (the tendency to sway). And I now found the TOW/HAWL mode was significantly a better setting. I found my speed hitting 78 mph a couple of times as things were so stable (but I quickly backed off those speeds). But was often running 73 mph which I never dared do before. I was even beginning to think I didn't need to upgrade the suspension. But the behavior in rough stuff (on and off-road) and knowing the improvements DJ has seen, I decided to continue with the new suspension. I had Kings on my 2016 4Runner and I want that behavior back.

I'll get the GX back on Saturday and will be able to update later next week as we head out again. Can't wait!

BENDOU,
Your post is super interesting and likely beneficial for many others here. We all appreciate your input and lessons learned; it’s a great read in the interest of towing safely with the GX.

I wanted to give you a sort of ‘final update’ of my own experiences while towing after my recent upgrades. The final key for me was upgrading to the E rated tires (Toyo 285/70R18, mounted on 18x8 +25 rims) just 2 weeks ago. I haven’t been as disciplined or detailed as you in weighing my double axle trailer which is a full 8 feet wide, very tall, about 22’ long hitch to tail. But basically I’m somewhere in the range of about 550 tongue weight. I use a WDH (solid bars) which also has an anti-sway mechanism. The hitch ball height is adjustable in 1.25” increments. My first tow I used 50 psi cold. I may play around with that pressure in the future.

The huge improvements and my ‘towing goals met’ I chalk up 70% to the MT64 suspension upgrade and the final 30% to the E rated tires. The new tire stiffness, resistance to lateral rolling (deformation), and a tad wider track (tire/wheel combination) are the tire’s contribution. I’m guesstimating about 3/4 to 1” wider track gained each side, based on the new slight poke - which looks great BTW.

We returned from our C.Springs ‘camping’ trip on Saturday. Before departing I debated whether to once again drop the ball height down. On the way over it had been at its ‘normal’ position, and the trailer was just very slightly nose up - depending on where I stopped to view it.
So I dropped it down for the return. It was the final key to making everything essentially perfect. The trailer now has a very slight nose down ride, the GX sits about perfect, the braking is safely normal, and I don’t have to consider installing airbags.
I’m super happy with the setup now. It pulls really well. It corners great. No sway, no weird bobbing up and down, bad spots on the road are immediately muted, no unsafe or scary input to the steering wheel, etc.

Yesterday I made my first ‘high speed’ non-towing run on the newly completed setup, tires set at 30 psi cold the previous day. If you’re familiar with the US-50 Delta-GJ portion you know it’s a super undulating, wavy road, with some lateral stunts thrown in for good measure.
I cruised that 75-85+ without issue, the tires and suspension working extremely well, floating through everything one-handed with great composure, really astonished and realizing I could have done 90-95 (but wouldn’t do it on that 65 mph road). I travel this stretch often - none of my other vehicles could do this so easily.

So..if there any questions, let me know! For myself I’ve met all my goals, I’m really happy with the new underpinnings on my GX.